theForum

Is this normal?


https://forum.unlock.org.uk/Topic28410.aspx

By lotsofquer - 12 Aug 20 9:32 PM

Hi

I'm only at the start of my journey in that I've been charged but my court date has been moved due to Covid etc etc. Mags court is coming up soon (provided it doesn't move again).

Recently I was denied legal aid as the Legal Aid agency has taken my business earnings for the past 12 months (of which there are really only 4 months of earnings) in to consideration when calculating my eligibility for legal aid.  This has taken me over the threshold for legal aid. I don't know if they should be considering these or not - given that they are not my funds but belong to the business. If they are required to be considered then do they need to take in to account the fact that a good portion of these funds are yet to be paid to HMRC in various forms of tax so actually belong to the taxpayer and not me or my business at all?  Either way would bring me under the threshold for legal aid.

I did query this with my solicitor who got back to me today and advised that it's going to be 'cheaper to pay privately' (her words). Nothing to address whether the legal aid agency should be or should not be considering these funds.

The costs I've been given are £1000+vat for mags court and $1500+vat for each crown court hearing.  She mentioned that there should only be one hearing at crown court which surprised me as I was expecting to be sent away from crown court and a pre-sentence report ordered. I have sent her an email to query this and also query who I'm paying - the court or the solicitors firm (not that I mind which - just would like to know the process).

I guess the questions I have around this being normal are:
Is it normal to have a pre-sentence report or not?
On legal aid
   - should my business earnings be considered as part of the eligibility criteria for legal aid?
   - if they should then should that money owed (but not due) to HMRC be deducted before they take a figure for eligibility?
   - Are the figures I've been quoted actual court fees or are they solicitors fees and actually there may be additional court fees on top of those?

Thanks
By JASB - 20 Aug 20 11:13 AM

CC - 19 Aug 20 8:13 PM
Mr W - 12 Aug 20 11:56 PM
Pre-sentence reports are fairly normal and sometimes hugely important, my advice would be to cram in as much positive stuff about your life as possible because there's not room for much of that during sentencing...!
Obviously show you're remorseful, ACTUALLY remorseful because they will see through fake remorse. Talk about what you've done since you stopped offending. Lay it all out there.

The process is uncomfortable though, it is like judge and jury, the woman I had was stern and detailed but she was doing her job. Mine ended with her saying I'd probably get a community order. However, when I came out with a 9 month suspended sentence and a lengthy SHPO - I was in shock. I know the Crown is open to all sentencing but to go from 'probably community order' to hair's width away from being sent down, it was just unreal.

Anyway, you're lucky to get all this advice beforehand, I wish I knew all this back then. You seem convinced you're going away, but if you do, please do come back and tell us what happened when you get out. As all of our experiences matter.

My solicitor went to a lot of trouble with my presentence report getting expert psycholical assessments which among other things assessed my risk as low etc but it was all a complete waste of time. The judge had to have his attention  drawn to the report before sentencing me. He just literaĺy flicked through the pages, harrumph loud enough for all to hear   and put it to one side with complete disregard. I think he had already made up his mind in my opinion.

Hi

I have spoken about the sentencing hearing previously. In my opinion the processes that hearing adhere to are just about tradition and show for the media and any public attending. Occasionally if an important fact is suddenly presented then that might change the process of that hearing but thats all.
In their chambers prior to the hearing the papers will of been read but also discussions with the defence and prosecution will have been ongoings and results passed to the Judge.

In regard to psychiatric reports they will help you in the future. I had 2 independent which no one will know if they helped me at my sentencing. However they helped tremendously when at HMP Whatton when they assessed me for a course - found not requiring to undertake any course. Again when on licence, Probation attempted again to place me on a course - again found not requiring to undertake any course. When I started to amend my sopo conditions the independent assessments formed the foundation stone for the legal points in my application.

Keep your copies and do not dismiss any supportive evidence. 
We must accept that at that hearing the Judge has already decided the sentence prior to seating down.