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DBS check information being shared with employers and background checking services


DBS check information being shared with employers and background...

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Neo Matrix
Neo Matrix
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Yankee - 16 Aug 18 5:06 PM
GaryTS - 16 Aug 18 3:34 PM
Thanks for clearing that info up for me chaps.

Its a shame most employers use standard checks so they will find out either way

So you can legally answer no to having no convictions, but when employer does a DBS standard check and it comes back  if they are not clued up about the ROA they are going to see it as we have lied because there is no indication to them if they are in fact spent or not.

I do not believe for one minuet that most employers use only basic DBS check.

I do not want to be stuck in a unskilled job for the rest of my life - I just feel i cant progress to my true potential because i will always be tarnished with my 2x dishonesty convictions : / they should really look into this sort of thing because many of us with convictions have made a mistake and have never reoffended and i feel we deserve a second chance.

I hope together we can be united and with unlocks help we can make a difference in the legislation of the future.

The vast majority of jobs can only ask for a basic check. Unlock has details of those that qualify for a standard or enhanced DBS. Any business undertaking a standard/enhanced check when the job is not on the prescribed list of exceptions is breaking the law.

Unfortunately there are grey areas and i'm sure there are employers who interpret the regulations for their own benefit and ask for a check which should not really be applicable for the role in question - while there are meant to be checks and balances in the system there is enough anecdotal evidence that these are rigorously enforced.

Having said all of that, to reiterate the first point - the vast majority of employers play by the rules and if you can provide a clear basic DBS you will find there will be lots of opportunity out there.

Obviously, steer clear of any role that involves interaction with children or vulnerable adults, and if you have dishonesty convictions I would steer clear of anything related to financial services. Beyond that, hopefully the world is your oyster as the saying goes...

Hey Yankee

I fully appreciate your positive attitude in your post.

I really hope that what you mention is the case in reality.
I do not like numbers/maths etc so the financial services is of no interest to me anyway - however its clear from my DBS that im not a prolific offender although its dishonesty based i hope that they would take other mitigating circumstances into consideration before putting me on the scrapheap so to speak.

Who knows lets just hope for a better and fairer future for us. 
Thanks again for your comments its always good to share experiences and opinions because it helps and produces a more positive vibe.
Yankee
Yankee
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Yankee - 16 Aug 18 5:06 PM
GaryTS - 16 Aug 18 3:34 PM
Thanks for clearing that info up for me chaps.

Its a shame most employers use standard checks so they will find out either way

So you can legally answer no to having no convictions, but when employer does a DBS standard check and it comes back  if they are not clued up about the ROA they are going to see it as we have lied because there is no indication to them if they are in fact spent or not.

I do not believe for one minuet that most employers use only basic DBS check.

I do not want to be stuck in a unskilled job for the rest of my life - I just feel i cant progress to my true potential because i will always be tarnished with my 2x dishonesty convictions : / they should really look into this sort of thing because many of us with convictions have made a mistake and have never reoffended and i feel we deserve a second chance.

I hope together we can be united and with unlocks help we can make a difference in the legislation of the future.

The vast majority of jobs can only ask for a basic check. Unlock has details of those that qualify for a standard or enhanced DBS. Any business undertaking a standard/enhanced check when the job is not on the prescribed list of exceptions is breaking the law.

Unfortunately there are grey areas and i'm sure there are employers who interpret the regulations for their own benefit and ask for a check which should not really be applicable for the role in question - while there are meant to be checks and balances in the system there is enough anecdotal evidence that these are rigorously enforced.

Having said all of that, to reiterate the first point - the vast majority of employers play by the rules and if you can provide a clear basic DBS you will find there will be lots of opportunity out there.

Obviously, steer clear of any role that involves interaction with children or vulnerable adults, and if you have dishonesty convictions I would steer clear of anything related to financial services. Beyond that, hopefully the world is your oyster as the saying goes...

...NOT rigorously enforced..

bit of a Donald Trump moment there
Yankee
Yankee
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GaryTS - 16 Aug 18 3:34 PM
Thanks for clearing that info up for me chaps.

Its a shame most employers use standard checks so they will find out either way

So you can legally answer no to having no convictions, but when employer does a DBS standard check and it comes back  if they are not clued up about the ROA they are going to see it as we have lied because there is no indication to them if they are in fact spent or not.

I do not believe for one minuet that most employers use only basic DBS check.

I do not want to be stuck in a unskilled job for the rest of my life - I just feel i cant progress to my true potential because i will always be tarnished with my 2x dishonesty convictions : / they should really look into this sort of thing because many of us with convictions have made a mistake and have never reoffended and i feel we deserve a second chance.

I hope together we can be united and with unlocks help we can make a difference in the legislation of the future.

The vast majority of jobs can only ask for a basic check. Unlock has details of those that qualify for a standard or enhanced DBS. Any business undertaking a standard/enhanced check when the job is not on the prescribed list of exceptions is breaking the law.

Unfortunately there are grey areas and i'm sure there are employers who interpret the regulations for their own benefit and ask for a check which should not really be applicable for the role in question - while there are meant to be checks and balances in the system there is enough anecdotal evidence that these are rigorously enforced.

Having said all of that, to reiterate the first point - the vast majority of employers play by the rules and if you can provide a clear basic DBS you will find there will be lots of opportunity out there.

Obviously, steer clear of any role that involves interaction with children or vulnerable adults, and if you have dishonesty convictions I would steer clear of anything related to financial services. Beyond that, hopefully the world is your oyster as the saying goes...
Neo Matrix
Neo Matrix
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Thanks for clearing that info up for me chaps.

Its a shame most employers use standard checks so they will find out either way

So you can legally answer no to having no convictions, but when employer does a DBS standard check and it comes back  if they are not clued up about the ROA they are going to see it as we have lied because there is no indication to them if they are in fact spent or not.

I do not believe for one minuet that most employers use only basic DBS check.

I do not want to be stuck in a unskilled job for the rest of my life - I just feel i cant progress to my true potential because i will always be tarnished with my 2x dishonesty convictions : / they should really look into this sort of thing because many of us with convictions have made a mistake and have never reoffended and i feel we deserve a second chance.

I hope together we can be united and with unlocks help we can make a difference in the legislation of the future.
AB2014
AB2014
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Yankee - 16 Aug 18 9:56 AM
GaryTS - 16 Aug 18 8:19 AM
Hi All

So in relation to the unspent convictions.

My 2 convictions are spent in October this year.

Will they simply be removed from a basic DBS check?

or will there be a marker to indicate that the convictions have now been spent?

does a standard/enhanced check state that convictions are spent?

The DBS accesses the police national computer for conviction information. I don't know whether there is a 'spent/unspent' flag on the PNC or whether the DBS extraction programme applies some logic (filtering rules for example, determining whether fines and costs have been paid etc.).

The last standard/enhanced check I saw does not specify whether a conviction is spent or unspent - it simply lists the conviction, date, court and disposal.

The PNC has no information about spent/unspent, as that is of no interest to the police, so they wouldn't have asked for it to be included when the system was set up. All that stuff is decided when the DBS processes the check. A basic check will only show unspent convictions, and once they become spent they disappear from basic DBS checks, never to return (subject to levels of competence & attentiveness). A standard or enhanced DBS check will show unfiltered cautions and convictions, and makes no mention of whether or not they are spent, as that is not strictly relevant to the purpose of the check, even if it is very relevant to the person who is the subject of the check.
Yankee
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GaryTS - 16 Aug 18 8:19 AM
Hi All

So in relation to the unspent convictions.

My 2 convictions are spent in October this year.

Will they simply be removed from a basic DBS check?

or will there be a marker to indicate that the convictions have now been spent?

does a standard/enhanced check state that convictions are spent?

The DBS accesses the police national computer for conviction information. I don't know whether there is a 'spent/unspent' flag on the PNC or whether the DBS extraction programme applies some logic (filtering rules for example, determining whether fines and costs have been paid etc.).

The last standard/enhanced check I saw does not specify whether a conviction is spent or unspent - it simply lists the conviction, date, court and disposal.
Neo Matrix
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Hi All

So in relation to the unspent convictions.

My 2 convictions are spent in October this year.

Will they simply be removed from a basic DBS check?

or will there be a marker to indicate that the convictions have now been spent?

does a standard/enhanced check state that convictions are spent?
AB2014
AB2014
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Yankee - 19 Apr 18 2:09 PM
AB2014 - 19 Apr 18 10:46 AM
BenS - 18 Apr 18 4:03 PM
From your screenshot, it is also alarming how the phrase "Unspent convictions:" is followed immediately by the word "Fail". Which seems to imply that you will automatically not get the job if you have an unspent conviction. OK, that is true 90% of the time, but is not a legal or automatic bar on getting the job.

Looking at the text at the bottom of the screenshot (upper box), the "failure" seems to be a failure to find any unspent convictions, which contradicts what the text above it says. In any case, if an employer is doing a basic DBS check on someone, they will see any unspent convictions anyway, whether that is online or on the paper certificate. The real worry is that employers will expect people to set up an account so that they pay for their own DBS checks and the employer can see the results immediately and free of charge. So, if you don't have an account, even if you have no unspent convictions, you are automatically less likely to get the job than someone with an account who has no unspent convictions.

I agree that unspent convictions are always going to appear on a certificate. My point was that the original process meant the certificate went to the applicant who then could check it and decide whether to share. If the DBS makes a mistake (it happens) you would have the opportunity to correct and get an updated certificate. Or maybe you simply were unsure what would appear on your certificate and would have the option of withdrawing from the recruitment process without the employer ever knowing why, other than the excuse you gave them.

This ability to check first will disappear with the type of screening service posted earlier.  

In theory, the employer will only be told that there may be something for them to see, but they would still need to see the paper certificate if there is no online account. If the certificate is wrong, that still gives you time to see it and challenge it before you hand it over. You can say that you are challenging it, but you are then relying on the employer doing the decent thing and not assuming you're a major risk when you actually have nothing to disclose.
Yankee
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AB2014 - 19 Apr 18 10:46 AM
BenS - 18 Apr 18 4:03 PM
From your screenshot, it is also alarming how the phrase "Unspent convictions:" is followed immediately by the word "Fail". Which seems to imply that you will automatically not get the job if you have an unspent conviction. OK, that is true 90% of the time, but is not a legal or automatic bar on getting the job.

Looking at the text at the bottom of the screenshot (upper box), the "failure" seems to be a failure to find any unspent convictions, which contradicts what the text above it says. In any case, if an employer is doing a basic DBS check on someone, they will see any unspent convictions anyway, whether that is online or on the paper certificate. The real worry is that employers will expect people to set up an account so that they pay for their own DBS checks and the employer can see the results immediately and free of charge. So, if you don't have an account, even if you have no unspent convictions, you are automatically less likely to get the job than someone with an account who has no unspent convictions.

I agree that unspent convictions are always going to appear on a certificate. My point was that the original process meant the certificate went to the applicant who then could check it and decide whether to share. If the DBS makes a mistake (it happens) you would have the opportunity to correct and get an updated certificate. Or maybe you simply were unsure what would appear on your certificate and would have the option of withdrawing from the recruitment process without the employer ever knowing why, other than the excuse you gave them.

This ability to check first will disappear with the type of screening service posted earlier.  
AB2014
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BenS - 18 Apr 18 4:03 PM
From your screenshot, it is also alarming how the phrase "Unspent convictions:" is followed immediately by the word "Fail". Which seems to imply that you will automatically not get the job if you have an unspent conviction. OK, that is true 90% of the time, but is not a legal or automatic bar on getting the job.

Looking at the text at the bottom of the screenshot (upper box), the "failure" seems to be a failure to find any unspent convictions, which contradicts what the text above it says. In any case, if an employer is doing a basic DBS check on someone, they will see any unspent convictions anyway, whether that is online or on the paper certificate. The real worry is that employers will expect people to set up an account so that they pay for their own DBS checks and the employer can see the results immediately and free of charge. So, if you don't have an account, even if you have no unspent convictions, you are automatically less likely to get the job than someone with an account who has no unspent convictions.
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