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Probation Questions


Probation Questions

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ChrisS
ChrisS
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I have a couple of questions around probation and specifically community offender managers whilst on licence, that I wonder if anyone can give me some advice on? I’ll give you a bit of background.

My COM would like me to do a stay at an approved premises, which I have no problem with and understand that this will be about 8-12 weeks. After this I would like to return to my parents. My parents are both in their 80s, my mum is 83 and suffers with Alzheimers, memory issues but nothing more serious yet. My dad is 81 and is the main carer for my mum, he is fully compos mentis, mobile with no issues at all.

My COM has stated that she will not approve the premises due to the fact that she believes that supporting my elderly parents will cause me too much stress whilst I am trying to adjust being back in the community from an Approved Premises. I don’t have any restrictions about living or working with vulnerable adults, which I believe my mum could be classified as. I do have restrictions about living or working with under-16s but there are none at this property or visiting this property. Stress was not linked to my offending, though depression and isolation, along with breakdown of support network, lack of communication and pornography use was.

My siblings live within 7 miles of my parents’ address, and I feel that the support provided to me by all of my family, outweighs the potential stress of supporting two elderly parents (not that I think I would, as my dad currently does all the caring for my mum).
I do not have the means to rent or buy a property after my stay in an AP, and I doubt the council will look favourably on me, firstly as a single adult male, and then as having a property that I could in fact go to.
So, my first question is can I be recalled to prison, whilst on licence if I don’t have anywhere to live after the AP?

Secondly, does anyone know how I would challenge my COM’s assessment of the property? I, obviously would prefer not to go down this route as I don’t want to create any bad feeling between myself and my COM, as she is managing me for the next few years on licence, but when I have brought up the above points, she just shuts me down with, “We will not approve the address”, so I feel have exhausted my options with her.  Is it possible to ask for a change of COM, has anybody had experience of this?

Thanks
AB2014
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ChrisS - 6 Jul 26 3:51 PM
I have a couple of questions around probation and specifically community offender managers whilst on licence, that I wonder if anyone can give me some advice on? I’ll give you a bit of background.

My COM would like me to do a stay at an approved premises, which I have no problem with and understand that this will be about 8-12 weeks. After this I would like to return to my parents. My parents are both in their 80s, my mum is 83 and suffers with Alzheimers, memory issues but nothing more serious yet. My dad is 81 and is the main carer for my mum, he is fully compos mentis, mobile with no issues at all.

My COM has stated that she will not approve the premises due to the fact that she believes that supporting my elderly parents will cause me too much stress whilst I am trying to adjust being back in the community from an Approved Premises. I don’t have any restrictions about living or working with vulnerable adults, which I believe my mum could be classified as. I do have restrictions about living or working with under-16s but there are none at this property or visiting this property. Stress was not linked to my offending, though depression and isolation, along with breakdown of support network, lack of communication and pornography use was.

My siblings live within 7 miles of my parents’ address, and I feel that the support provided to me by all of my family, outweighs the potential stress of supporting two elderly parents (not that I think I would, as my dad currently does all the caring for my mum).
I do not have the means to rent or buy a property after my stay in an AP, and I doubt the council will look favourably on me, firstly as a single adult male, and then as having a property that I could in fact go to.
So, my first question is can I be recalled to prison, whilst on licence if I don’t have anywhere to live after the AP?

Secondly, does anyone know how I would challenge my COM’s assessment of the property? I, obviously would prefer not to go down this route as I don’t want to create any bad feeling between myself and my COM, as she is managing me for the next few years on licence, but when I have brought up the above points, she just shuts me down with, “We will not approve the address”, so I feel have exhausted my options with her.  Is it possible to ask for a change of COM, has anybody had experience of this?

Thanks

The first thing you could try is to get your father to contact probation and explain that he wants you to live there, as he would appreciate your help with things like shopping and so on, so he can remain at home with your mother more of the time. You can also challenge the decision directly once you get to your AP, as you should then have to go to the probation office for appointments at some stage. Firstly raise the subject with your COM and if she won't budge, ask if you can discuss it informally with her and her line manager. If they still won't change the decision, you would need to make a formal complaint. Unlock has information about that here. You could also check their policy framework document for address checks, as it's usually best to know what their rules are so you can concentrate on that rather than stuff that any emotional reasons, such as being sure stress won't apply as you love your mother and you will be happy to help your father. Then again, you can reference the stress of finding accommodation, as that is an important part of your OASys assessment and something they have to consider.

Regarding caring for your mother, the DBS shouldn't consider barring you, as it would be a private family arrangement. If you're already barred, it is irrelevant to private family arrangments.

For accommodation, your AP is considered CAS1 accommodation, and when you leave, your COM can apply for you to go to CAS2 or CAS3 accommodation. Even so, local authorities may well decide not to give you accommodation and you might have to try the lower-quality end of the private rental market. You would still need a rent deposit, and everything else depends on the landlord/letting agent. If they don't ask, you don't have to disclose, unless probation insist, in which case that supports your argument for being allowed to live at your parents' address.

=========================================================================================================

If you are to punish a man retributively you must injure him. If you are to reform him you must improve him. And men are not improved by injuries. (George Bernard Shaw)

ChrisS
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Thanks AB Smile
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AB2014 - 7 Jul 26 10:02 AM
ChrisS - 6 Jul 26 3:51 PM
I have a couple of questions around probation and specifically community offender managers whilst on licence, that I wonder if anyone can give me some advice on? I’ll give you a bit of background.

My COM would like me to do a stay at an approved premises, which I have no problem with and understand that this will be about 8-12 weeks. After this I would like to return to my parents. My parents are both in their 80s, my mum is 83 and suffers with Alzheimers, memory issues but nothing more serious yet. My dad is 81 and is the main carer for my mum, he is fully compos mentis, mobile with no issues at all.

My COM has stated that she will not approve the premises due to the fact that she believes that supporting my elderly parents will cause me too much stress whilst I am trying to adjust being back in the community from an Approved Premises. I don’t have any restrictions about living or working with vulnerable adults, which I believe my mum could be classified as. I do have restrictions about living or working with under-16s but there are none at this property or visiting this property. Stress was not linked to my offending, though depression and isolation, along with breakdown of support network, lack of communication and pornography use was.

My siblings live within 7 miles of my parents’ address, and I feel that the support provided to me by all of my family, outweighs the potential stress of supporting two elderly parents (not that I think I would, as my dad currently does all the caring for my mum).
I do not have the means to rent or buy a property after my stay in an AP, and I doubt the council will look favourably on me, firstly as a single adult male, and then as having a property that I could in fact go to.
So, my first question is can I be recalled to prison, whilst on licence if I don’t have anywhere to live after the AP?

Secondly, does anyone know how I would challenge my COM’s assessment of the property? I, obviously would prefer not to go down this route as I don’t want to create any bad feeling between myself and my COM, as she is managing me for the next few years on licence, but when I have brought up the above points, she just shuts me down with, “We will not approve the address”, so I feel have exhausted my options with her.  Is it possible to ask for a change of COM, has anybody had experience of this?

Thanks

The first thing you could try is to get your father to contact probation and explain that he wants you to live there, as he would appreciate your help with things like shopping and so on, so he can remain at home with your mother more of the time. You can also challenge the decision directly once you get to your AP, as you should then have to go to the probation office for appointments at some stage. Firstly raise the subject with your COM and if she won't budge, ask if you can discuss it informally with her and her line manager. If they still won't change the decision, you would need to make a formal complaint. Unlock has information about that here. You could also check their policy framework document for address checks, as it's usually best to know what their rules are so you can concentrate on that rather than stuff that any emotional reasons, such as being sure stress won't apply as you love your mother and you will be happy to help your father. Then again, you can reference the stress of finding accommodation, as that is an important part of your OASys assessment and something they have to consider.

Regarding caring for your mother, the DBS shouldn't consider barring you, as it would be a private family arrangement. If you're already barred, it is irrelevant to private family arrangments.

For accommodation, your AP is considered CAS1 accommodation, and when you leave, your COM can apply for you to go to CAS2 or CAS3 accommodation. Even so, local authorities may well decide not to give you accommodation and you might have to try the lower-quality end of the private rental market. You would still need a rent deposit, and everything else depends on the landlord/letting agent. If they don't ask, you don't have to disclose, unless probation insist, in which case that supports your argument for being allowed to live at your parents' address.

Fully agree

thought you have to be aware of any consequences in the future if she gets upset do not let it stop you requesting a rethink etc.
It will show that you are able to hold sensible and constructive and positive discussions; this is "self belief" which is a good aspect to have.

Also she may be just trying to protect herself against you "relapsing" due to stress or whatever and that would go against her. Document properly how you will manage things and the support network you are putting in place just in case you feel overwhelmed.Things like that may sound "soft" when you are trying to show the world you are in "control" but the world will think twice because in your past you didn't control your whatever. No offence meant.

Stay strong and believe in yourself

Society suggests I must let go of all my expectations but I disagree, as whilst I have a voice, I have hope.

Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
------------------------------

This forum supports these words, thank you Unlock and your contributors.

GO


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