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Voluteering in Coronavirus outbreak!


Voluteering in Coronavirus outbreak!

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JASB
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Simon1983 - 3 Apr 20 7:12 AM
Morning every one, 

there is a positive out come to the NHS National volunteering program run by the Royal voluntary service, 

I am set up and ready to start next week when the system goes live.

i received a FAQ last night, they are only running an enhanced DBS on the role of patient transport, all other roles are not being DBS and there is no question on application form about criminal convictions.

all you require to sign up is proof of I’d like passport or driving licence.

just thought I would update you all

all the best and stay safe 

Many thanks for the confirmation and I will apply for a non driving role.

Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
Simon1983
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Morning every one, 

there is a positive out come to the NHS National volunteering program run by the Royal voluntary service, 

I am set up and ready to start next week when the system goes live.

i received a FAQ last night, they are only running an enhanced DBS on the role of patient transport, all other roles are not being DBS and there is no question on application form about criminal convictions.

all you require to sign up is proof of I’d like passport or driving licence.

just thought I would update you all

all the best and stay safe 
JASB
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punter99 - 2 Apr 20 10:46 AM
JASB - 30 Mar 20 4:38 PM
punter99 - 29 Mar 20 1:59 PM
The first place to look is the wording of your SHPO. Some are more prescriptive than others. Providing that doesn't exclude the activity you are thinking about, then give the PPU a specfic example of what you want to do, rather than just saying "I want to volunteer". For the PPU to issue a blanket ban on all types of volunteering seems unreasonable.

The default position of most PPU, when confronted with an unfamiliar situation, that their training didn't cover, is to ban, prohibit and exclude. Although they can pretty much invent any excuse they like for you not doing it, e.g. you might accidentally pass a child in the street, when delivering a food parcel and so on, it may help if you can demonstrate to them that you have considered all the potential risks and I would point out to them that, reintegrating an ex-offender into society requires the development of social ties. This seems like a great opportunity for ex-offenders to give something back.

I believe there are a variety of different roles on offer, like phoning elderly people at home to see if they are ok. Given social distancing rules, you are unlikely to come into physical contact with anybody; adults or children. Leaving a food parcel outside somebodies front door is not endangering the public. Before approaching the PPU, I would suggest being clear about what role you are looking for and what it might involve. That way you can counter some of their "well there might be a child somewhere, so no" arguments.

Hi
Please do not think I am suggesting the self protection guidelines you mention are not correct as I have held many conversations with various PPU's and know success is limited by the "management" processes of the specific PPU.

Over the weekend I have again called and attempted to discuss the subject with NHS authorities involved and radio 5 chat shows. Unfortutantly responses were not forthcoming as it is not a "news worthy" or "subject positive" conversation for them.

Thinking from certain media headline methods , you may remember a couple of years ago the Sun raising the question of sex offenders in prison making toys for children and trying to portray a certain image. It did not get much condemnation. Therefore the newspapers would only use the same "image forming" headlines about ex-offenders making telephone calls. I will leave it to your imagination what they would suggest.

I hope you see my words as not attacking the praiseworthy efforts of ex-offenders trying to help society, but just looking at the possible consequences to both the Government and NHS from allowing us to volunteer.
However more importantly I am hoping to raise the fact that possible rejection could cause further psychological damage to ex-offenders because a policy was not thought through fully.

As I said I am hoping my concerns are not found to be correct, but as an ex soldier once told me, always check what is at risk before volunteering.   

heres hoping we all keep safe.

I believe I was making that point, about considering what kind of volunteering you want to do and the risks associated with it. In any risk assessment, it's important to be realistic and not allow yourself to be paralysed, by fear of the worst case scenario. Every time I cross the road, I run the risk of being hit by a car, so does that mean I should never try to cross the road?

Of course, someone might find out that you are an SO and they might tell the press, and they might put a big headline on their front pages about SO volunteering. There are any number of worst case scenarios and I've no doubt the PPU will be thinking all of them. e.g. "he wants to volunteer, that must mean he is looking for an opportunity to offend" and then "if he offends, then the media are bound to find out about it and I might lose my job.", which will lead them to the inevitable conclusion: "he WILL offend, I WILL lose my job, therefore I must say no to his request".

That's why it's important to consider all the risks yourself and assess them realistically, before speaking to the PPU. Don't just fall into the trap of thinking "I'm on the register, the PPU will never allow me to volunteer, so I won't even ask if that's possible, because I already know they will say no".

Hi

Bascially we have very similar views, though I do believe we differ on how we interface with those thats purpose is to protect society. I accept your opinion though different to mine.
I could quote chapter and versus about the false and unsupported views they can hold from a personal perspective e.g. psychological conclusions or offence events, but I still approach them ready to constructively challenge any unsubstantiated responses.

My initial reply was only meant to make readers aware that the opportunity, though welcome may have responses that could cause further damage to the applicant; for instance rejection when they have to disclose or their offence is highlighted. As per my point of the NHS etc considering their image damage by media finding out who they select, see the following:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-52137109

A person cannot even pass away due to the virus without society being reminded specifically of a persons offence.

The plus side to providing information to the PPU, is to show our willingness to assist society and not the " Don't just fall into the trap of thinking "I'm on the register,.........."

We both know that unfortuantley not all consider the consequences of an opportunity fully hence the questions and mainly supportive replies that appear on the forum.
By debating them I would hope it would allow a person to make better decissions for their personal circumstances.

I am still hopeing a positive outcome to Simon1983 application; which hopefully will be a positive one.





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punter99
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JASB - 30 Mar 20 4:38 PM
punter99 - 29 Mar 20 1:59 PM
The first place to look is the wording of your SHPO. Some are more prescriptive than others. Providing that doesn't exclude the activity you are thinking about, then give the PPU a specfic example of what you want to do, rather than just saying "I want to volunteer". For the PPU to issue a blanket ban on all types of volunteering seems unreasonable.

The default position of most PPU, when confronted with an unfamiliar situation, that their training didn't cover, is to ban, prohibit and exclude. Although they can pretty much invent any excuse they like for you not doing it, e.g. you might accidentally pass a child in the street, when delivering a food parcel and so on, it may help if you can demonstrate to them that you have considered all the potential risks and I would point out to them that, reintegrating an ex-offender into society requires the development of social ties. This seems like a great opportunity for ex-offenders to give something back.

I believe there are a variety of different roles on offer, like phoning elderly people at home to see if they are ok. Given social distancing rules, you are unlikely to come into physical contact with anybody; adults or children. Leaving a food parcel outside somebodies front door is not endangering the public. Before approaching the PPU, I would suggest being clear about what role you are looking for and what it might involve. That way you can counter some of their "well there might be a child somewhere, so no" arguments.

Hi
Please do not think I am suggesting the self protection guidelines you mention are not correct as I have held many conversations with various PPU's and know success is limited by the "management" processes of the specific PPU.

Over the weekend I have again called and attempted to discuss the subject with NHS authorities involved and radio 5 chat shows. Unfortutantly responses were not forthcoming as it is not a "news worthy" or "subject positive" conversation for them.

Thinking from certain media headline methods , you may remember a couple of years ago the Sun raising the question of sex offenders in prison making toys for children and trying to portray a certain image. It did not get much condemnation. Therefore the newspapers would only use the same "image forming" headlines about ex-offenders making telephone calls. I will leave it to your imagination what they would suggest.

I hope you see my words as not attacking the praiseworthy efforts of ex-offenders trying to help society, but just looking at the possible consequences to both the Government and NHS from allowing us to volunteer.
However more importantly I am hoping to raise the fact that possible rejection could cause further psychological damage to ex-offenders because a policy was not thought through fully.

As I said I am hoping my concerns are not found to be correct, but as an ex soldier once told me, always check what is at risk before volunteering.   

heres hoping we all keep safe.

I believe I was making that point, about considering what kind of volunteering you want to do and the risks associated with it. In any risk assessment, it's important to be realistic and not allow yourself to be paralysed, by fear of the worst case scenario. Every time I cross the road, I run the risk of being hit by a car, so does that mean I should never try to cross the road?

Of course, someone might find out that you are an SO and they might tell the press, and they might put a big headline on their front pages about SO volunteering. There are any number of worst case scenarios and I've no doubt the PPU will be thinking all of them. e.g. "he wants to volunteer, that must mean he is looking for an opportunity to offend" and then "if he offends, then the media are bound to find out about it and I might lose my job.", which will lead them to the inevitable conclusion: "he WILL offend, I WILL lose my job, therefore I must say no to his request".

That's why it's important to consider all the risks yourself and assess them realistically, before speaking to the PPU. Don't just fall into the trap of thinking "I'm on the register, the PPU will never allow me to volunteer, so I won't even ask if that's possible, because I already know they will say no".

JASB
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Simon1983 - 30 Mar 20 5:12 PM
It does seem that the government is willing to bend many rules during this national emergency, to just the limit before breaking point.

i am waiting for the great red tops like the sun or the daily scare (the daily mail) to pick up on the fact that the agencies that are looking to staff these new Covid 19 super hospitals With ancillary staff are doing so by only undertaking a basic DBS on the likes of ward clerks and porters, that are in fact enhanced DBS. I am talking about paid positions here not voluntary ones.  

can you see the headlines now that a sex offender (Who’s conviction is spent) (is or is not still on the register) that is also on the bared list has got a job working as a porter in one of these new hospitals, a basic dbs would not pick up is spent conviction or the fact he was on a bared list.

thats one tangled web 

Hi
That is one of the points I was raising.

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It does seem that the government is willing to bend many rules during this national emergency, to just the limit before breaking point.

i am waiting for the great red tops like the sun or the daily scare (the daily mail) to pick up on the fact that the agencies that are looking to staff these new Covid 19 super hospitals With ancillary staff are doing so by only undertaking a basic DBS on the likes of ward clerks and porters, that are in fact enhanced DBS. I am talking about paid positions here not voluntary ones.  

can you see the headlines now that a sex offender (Who’s conviction is spent) (is or is not still on the register) that is also on the bared list has got a job working as a porter in one of these new hospitals, a basic dbs would not pick up is spent conviction or the fact he was on a bared list.

thats one tangled web 
JASB
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punter99 - 29 Mar 20 1:59 PM
The first place to look is the wording of your SHPO. Some are more prescriptive than others. Providing that doesn't exclude the activity you are thinking about, then give the PPU a specfic example of what you want to do, rather than just saying "I want to volunteer". For the PPU to issue a blanket ban on all types of volunteering seems unreasonable.

The default position of most PPU, when confronted with an unfamiliar situation, that their training didn't cover, is to ban, prohibit and exclude. Although they can pretty much invent any excuse they like for you not doing it, e.g. you might accidentally pass a child in the street, when delivering a food parcel and so on, it may help if you can demonstrate to them that you have considered all the potential risks and I would point out to them that, reintegrating an ex-offender into society requires the development of social ties. This seems like a great opportunity for ex-offenders to give something back.

I believe there are a variety of different roles on offer, like phoning elderly people at home to see if they are ok. Given social distancing rules, you are unlikely to come into physical contact with anybody; adults or children. Leaving a food parcel outside somebodies front door is not endangering the public. Before approaching the PPU, I would suggest being clear about what role you are looking for and what it might involve. That way you can counter some of their "well there might be a child somewhere, so no" arguments.

Hi
Please do not think I am suggesting the self protection guidelines you mention are not correct as I have held many conversations with various PPU's and know success is limited by the "management" processes of the specific PPU.

Over the weekend I have again called and attempted to discuss the subject with NHS authorities involved and radio 5 chat shows. Unfortutantly responses were not forthcoming as it is not a "news worthy" or "subject positive" conversation for them.

Thinking from certain media headline methods , you may remember a couple of years ago the Sun raising the question of sex offenders in prison making toys for children and trying to portray a certain image. It did not get much condemnation. Therefore the newspapers would only use the same "image forming" headlines about ex-offenders making telephone calls. I will leave it to your imagination what they would suggest.

I hope you see my words as not attacking the praiseworthy efforts of ex-offenders trying to help society, but just looking at the possible consequences to both the Government and NHS from allowing us to volunteer.
However more importantly I am hoping to raise the fact that possible rejection could cause further psychological damage to ex-offenders because a policy was not thought through fully.

As I said I am hoping my concerns are not found to be correct, but as an ex soldier once told me, always check what is at risk before volunteering.   

heres hoping we all keep safe.

Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
punter99
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The first place to look is the wording of your SHPO. Some are more prescriptive than others. Providing that doesn't exclude the activity you are thinking about, then give the PPU a specfic example of what you want to do, rather than just saying "I want to volunteer". For the PPU to issue a blanket ban on all types of volunteering seems unreasonable.

The default position of most PPU, when confronted with an unfamiliar situation, that their training didn't cover, is to ban, prohibit and exclude. Although they can pretty much invent any excuse they like for you not doing it, e.g. you might accidentally pass a child in the street, when delivering a food parcel and so on, it may help if you can demonstrate to them that you have considered all the potential risks and I would point out to them that, reintegrating an ex-offender into society requires the development of social ties. This seems like a great opportunity for ex-offenders to give something back.

I believe there are a variety of different roles on offer, like phoning elderly people at home to see if they are ok. Given social distancing rules, you are unlikely to come into physical contact with anybody; adults or children. Leaving a food parcel outside somebodies front door is not endangering the public. Before approaching the PPU, I would suggest being clear about what role you are looking for and what it might involve. That way you can counter some of their "well there might be a child somewhere, so no" arguments.
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Simon1983 - 27 Mar 20 12:42 PM
I understand your point on self protection, but after 10yrs with the same PPU Officer they know me, and don’t hear from them until I call them to do in and resign once a year, so they would not automatically presume guilt.

On another note there  would be no reason to inform PPU, there is no requirement as part of the SOR to inform them of any job you are doing be it voluntary or not, and the role does not break any section of my SOPO.

Hi
I have been on the SOR / SOPO for 10 years also, been low risk etc and never been found suitable for any SO treatment courses -  5 different psychologists assessed me.
I understand your point but I know from experience of relocating areas not all PPU practices work the same. All I was suggesting is that you have to protect yourself. As far as notifying PPU, you will know risk assessments are done and needed with applying for SOP and eventually SOR removal. This information on your file is good and shows proactive support to society and your PPU. That really is a discussion for a separate topic which I am willing to have if you raise the topic. Smile

More relevant to this post, you are correct that the Goodsam website says
Patient transport drivers will require an enhanced DBS check and will receive guidance to do this role safely, also included within the 'getting started pack'.


However I have tried to contact the NHS etc to ask about other roles and checks but obviously not easy to at this moment. I did contact a local volunteer centre and they said ANY contact roles would need DBS checks as what is the difference between going to someone's door and calling them. Imagine what the newspapers would headline if they discovered this.
Reading my posts you will see I promote and support the belief in "rehabilitation" but in the end "public image and perception" is a major enemy of us.

I do hope you come back and prove my information / words wrong.

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I understand your point on self protection, but after 10yrs with the same PPU Officer they know me, and don’t hear from them until I call them to do in and resign once a year, so they would not automatically presume guilt.

On another note there  would be no reason to inform PPU, there is no requirement as part of the SOR to inform them of any job you are doing be it voluntary or not, and the role does not break any section of my SOPO.
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Simon1983 - 27 Mar 20 12:09 PM
Hi every I hope you are all keeping safe, 

I know a number of you have been talking about volunteering during this national emergency and putting something back into the community.

As a person with a past sex offence from 2008 for images and having served a prising sentence, placing me on the register for life and having an active SOPO, and due to the nature of my job at conviction being placed on both barred lists I was hesitant to look at volunteering.

i took the plunge and completed the application form for the NHS Volunteer responders to be a check in chat volunteer.

https://www.goodsamapp.org/NHS

I was not asked to disclose any criminal conviction at any time (it seems the only role that requires a DBS Enhanced is to undertake one of the driver roles)

so having completed the application and uploading my driving licence as proof of ID I sent it off.

This morning I got my acceptance email and logging details for the Goodsam app that this is being run through.

so if you want to help and put back into the community sign up there is no harm.

hope this is useful 

and all remember to stay safe 





Hi

Many thanks for this example as my reading of the advert was all checks had to be done.
I would wonder what your PPU will say when you inform them? I would suggest you do simply becuase - and do not think in any way I am suggesting you would - someone gets upset by your words and complains how do you prove you are inocent if calls are not recorded.
Only raise the point for self protection.
Lets hope your calls bring the same joy as your update does.

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Hi every I hope you are all keeping safe, 

I know a number of you have been talking about volunteering during this national emergency and putting something back into the community.

As a person with a past sex offence from 2008 for images and having served a prising sentence, placing me on the register for life and having an active SOPO, and due to the nature of my job at conviction being placed on both barred lists I was hesitant to look at volunteering.

i took the plunge and completed the application form for the NHS Volunteer responders to be a check in chat volunteer.

https://www.goodsamapp.org/NHS

I was not asked to disclose any criminal conviction at any time (it seems the only role that requires a DBS Enhanced is to undertake one of the driver roles)

so having completed the application and uploading my driving licence as proof of ID I sent it off.

This morning I got my acceptance email and logging details for the Goodsam app that this is being run through.

so if you want to help and put back into the community sign up there is no harm.

hope this is useful 

and all remember to stay safe 





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JASB - 26 Mar 20 12:26 PM
Deb S - 25 Mar 20 4:13 PM

Hi
Many thanks for this and is useful. Not being a cynic but to raise this fact with a local group who asked the question does highlight you have a record Lol. Sad

As ever I do thank you for your excellent support.

The answer is No! Annoying but he used the example of a duty of care to me to keep me safe and not have malicious allegations against me. I suppose in the present situation I shouldn't be arguing with them. Is theer anything we'll ever be able to do again in our lives?

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Deb S - 25 Mar 20 4:13 PM

Hi
Many thanks for this and is useful. Not being a cynic but to raise this fact with a local group who asked the question does highlight you have a record Lol. Sad

As ever I do thank you for your excellent support.

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Hi All

Thought this latest Fact Sheet from the DBS regarding volunteering during the Coronavirus outbreak was quite interesting.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/safeguarding-factsheet-community-volunteers-during-covid-19-outbreak?utm_source=df797647-7b01-4902-bf0a-9379a287b547&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=govuk-notifications&utm_content=immediate

Debs 

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Mr W - 20 Mar 20 9:05 PM
Jonathan61 - 20 Mar 20 6:57 PM
Hi all. Currently, I believe I have COVID-19. I've had mild flu-like symptoms and I am recovering. Once out of isolation I'll be one person who can go around offering help.

I shall be calling my supervising officer and offering my services. Yes, I have a conviction of looking at pictures, but come on... does that really make me a really bad person?

NO IT DOESN'T!!!!!

I have a heart of gold and I made a big mistake. However, haven't I had justice served upon me and have a future.

So to everyone who has a conviction - why don't we offer our help to those in the community subject to our "supervisors" permission?

Could this not show those who keep an eye on us that we can be good citizens again?

I'm going to try my best!

Keep well and stay safe everyone.

While your enthusiasm and willingness to help should be commended, I'd assume anyone with a SHPO and/or have to make annual notifications (I'm making a conscious effort to not use that label) would probably be "nudged" to keep away. Especially as schools are closed and vulnerable adults are priority for protection.
That's not to say if you can find opportunities which would *guarantee* that you were to not come into contact with those groups then, by all means, try those and you could perhaps share those ideas with those of us here.

EDIT - It seems supermarkets are hiring including closed-to-the-public overnight shifts - even those of us with the most testing of scenarios - SHPO/unspent/other BS - might be given a break?

Hi
As readers know I am an ex-SO, low risk etc etc.
I know the major supermarkets are advertising but they still want disclosures so still being rejected as there are plenty of "ex-bar" staff.
My PPU even stopped me showing people around empty homes for sale; incase their was a child without parents there for me to declare to?
Anybody know any under 18's buying property?



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Jonathan61 - 20 Mar 20 6:57 PM
Hi all. Currently, I believe I have COVID-19. I've had mild flu-like symptoms and I am recovering. Once out of isolation I'll be one person who can go around offering help.

I shall be calling my supervising officer and offering my services. Yes, I have a conviction of looking at pictures, but come on... does that really make me a really bad person?

NO IT DOESN'T!!!!!

I have a heart of gold and I made a big mistake. However, haven't I had justice served upon me and have a future.

So to everyone who has a conviction - why don't we offer our help to those in the community subject to our "supervisors" permission?

Could this not show those who keep an eye on us that we can be good citizens again?

I'm going to try my best!

Keep well and stay safe everyone.

While your enthusiasm and willingness to help should be commended, I'd assume anyone with a SHPO and/or have to make annual notifications (I'm making a conscious effort to not use that label) would probably be "nudged" to keep away. Especially as schools are closed and vulnerable adults are priority for protection.
That's not to say if you can find opportunities which would *guarantee* that you were to not come into contact with those groups then, by all means, try those and you could perhaps share those ideas with those of us here.

EDIT - It seems supermarkets are hiring including closed-to-the-public overnight shifts - even those of us with the most testing of scenarios - SHPO/unspent/other BS - might be given a break?

=====
Fighting or Accepting - its difficult to know which is right and when.
Edited
6 Months Ago by Mr W
Jonathan61
Jonathan61
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 19, Visits: 150
Hi all. Currently, I believe I have COVID-19. I've had mild flu-like symptoms and I am recovering. Once out of isolation I'll be one person who can go around offering help.

I shall be calling my supervising officer and offering my services. Yes, I have a conviction of looking at pictures, but come on... does that really make me a really bad person?

NO IT DOESN'T!!!!!

I have a heart of gold and I made a big mistake. However, haven't I had justice served upon me and have a future.

So to everyone who has a conviction - why don't we offer our help to those in the community subject to our "supervisors" permission?

Could this not show those who keep an eye on us that we can be good citizens again?

I'm going to try my best!

Keep well and stay safe everyone.

Edited
6 Months Ago by Jonathan61
GO


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