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punter99
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A new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing?
In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways.
a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted.
or
b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope.
Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a).
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Mr W
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Another poor treating of the symptom, not the cause.
And yet another law which will have an adverse effect on men. I can't imagine any men running to the police if they get sent a pic from a woman, unsolicited or not.
I'm a millennial, so not THAT old, but even I'm baffled at this normalised sounding action of sending of nudes / D pics, especially to someone you don't know.
Where has it come from?!
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Fighting or Accepting - its difficult to know which is right and when.
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punter99
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Group: Forum Members
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+xAnother poor treating of the symptom, not the cause. And yet another law which will have an adverse effect on men. I can't imagine any men running to the police if they get sent a pic from a woman, unsolicited or not. I'm a millennial, so not THAT old, but even I'm baffled at this normalised sounding action of sending of nudes / D pics, especially to someone you don't know. Where has it come from?! Good question. The psychology suggests that it's quite a common, attention seeking behaviour, learned in childhood, but normally constrained by societal norms. In other words, people don't do it, unless they are disinhibited by alcohol for example, for fear of being publically shamed. But on the internet they feel safe because of the anonymity. There is no disapproving 'parent', or pseudo-parent, in the case of the public gaze, to tell them off. That's why it has ballooned in line with internet use The 'extreme' cases, where people do it in the offline world, are something similar, but pathologised to a point where it's almost a form of compulsive behaviour.
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JASB
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+xA new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female.
Society suggests I must let go of all my expectations but I disagree, as whilst I have a voice, I have hope.
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
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This forum supports these words, thank you Unlock and your contributors.
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punter99
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+xA new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female. This was an unusual situation. The person was an SO with previous convictions and his sentence reflects the breach of his SHPO as well as him being under a suspended sentence at the time. He used his fathers phone to send the images and told his dad that he was calling probation! I think that the reporting was mainly because it was the first ever prosecution for this offence in England. That's what made it newsworthy. Also the intention of the authorities was probably to send a deterrent message to other men. Because this is so common, most men probably don't even know that it's illegal.
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AB2014
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+xA new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). I think they might have another option, which would be to issue cautions, as I doubt having loads of these cases ending in NFA will please HM Inspector of Constabulary. They would only prosecute above a certain threshold, such as a repeat offender, SOR, suspended sentence, etc.
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If you are to punish a man retributively you must injure him. If you are to reform him you must improve him. And men are not improved by injuries. (George Bernard Shaw)
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JASB
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Group: Awaiting Activation
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+x+x+xA new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female. This was an unusual situation. The person was an SO with previous convictions and his sentence reflects the breach of his SHPO as well as him being under a suspended sentence at the time. He used his fathers phone to send the images and told his dad that he was calling probation! I think that the reporting was mainly because it was the first ever prosecution for this offence in England. That's what made it newsworthy. Also the intention of the authorities was probably to send a deterrent message to other men. Because this is so common, most men probably don't even know that it's illegal. Hi I think we all agree with the authorities "intensions" but also some "parties" will also use this as further proof of rehabilatation not working with SO's - which will have implications for us all. have a good weekend.
Society suggests I must let go of all my expectations but I disagree, as whilst I have a voice, I have hope.
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
------------------------------
This forum supports these words, thank you Unlock and your contributors.
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Mr W
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 467,
Visits: 5.6K
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+x+xAnother poor treating of the symptom, not the cause. And yet another law which will have an adverse effect on men. I can't imagine any men running to the police if they get sent a pic from a woman, unsolicited or not. I'm a millennial, so not THAT old, but even I'm baffled at this normalised sounding action of sending of nudes / D pics, especially to someone you don't know. Where has it come from?! Good question. The psychology suggests that it's quite a common, attention seeking behaviour, learned in childhood, but normally constrained by societal norms. In other words, people don't do it, unless they are disinhibited by alcohol for example, for fear of being publically shamed. But on the internet they feel safe because of the anonymity. There is no disapproving 'parent', or pseudo-parent, in the case of the public gaze, to tell them off. That's why it has ballooned in line with internet use The 'extreme' cases, where people do it in the offline world, are something similar, but pathologised to a point where it's almost a form of compulsive behaviour. Coincidentally, I’ve just seen a tweet on anon_opin saying lockdown was the ‘pinnacle’ of sending and receiving. I have to say it bypassed me. So I'm not totally sold on the being anon/drunk in all cases.
I wonder if it's a poor replacement for 'fooling around' when you first start dating someone. We forget that technology becoming part of our everyday lives has only really taken hold over the past 10 years.
So I'd imagine there are all sorts of new 'ways' of all sorts of things that have been spawned, sadly, most of which probably mean, or lead to, more isolation.
===== Fighting or Accepting - its difficult to know which is right and when.
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Mr W
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 467,
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+x+x+x[quote]A new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female. This was an unusual situation. The person was an SO with previous convictions and his sentence reflects the breach of his SHPO as well as him being under a suspended sentence at the time. He used his fathers phone to send the images and told his dad that he was calling probation! I think that the reporting was mainly because it was the first ever prosecution for this offence in England. That's what made it newsworthy. Also the intention of the authorities was probably to send a deterrent message to other men. Because this is so common, most men probably don't even know that it's illegal. Okay, dissecting this a bit, so he had a SHPO and is a repeat offender during a suspended sentence - that in itself completely ups the ante in terms of new sentence. The sending a pic to a child, there’s already a law for that, so that’s not new. But, considering the situation he's already in, meant he would have gone to prison anyway. (Although how he previously got a community order for sexual activity leaves me baffled!?). So the single offence of cyber flash *to the adult* was probably just an aggravating factor among everything else? Rather than him specifically being jailed for that one offence. So we don't know what would happen if an adult offended against an adult and that being the only offence.
Although, how on earth they prove "sending a photograph or film of genitals to cause alarm, distress or humiliation" (from The Guardian) leaves me scratching my head.
===== Fighting or Accepting - its difficult to know which is right and when.
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punter99
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 775,
Visits: 5.8K
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+x+x+x+x[quote]A new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female. This was an unusual situation. The person was an SO with previous convictions and his sentence reflects the breach of his SHPO as well as him being under a suspended sentence at the time. He used his fathers phone to send the images and told his dad that he was calling probation! I think that the reporting was mainly because it was the first ever prosecution for this offence in England. That's what made it newsworthy. Also the intention of the authorities was probably to send a deterrent message to other men. Because this is so common, most men probably don't even know that it's illegal. Okay, dissecting this a bit, so he had a SHPO and is a repeat offender during a suspended sentence - that in itself completely ups the ante in terms of new sentence. The sending a pic to a child, there’s already a law for that, so that’s not new. But, considering the situation he's already in, meant he would have gone to prison anyway. (Although how he previously got a community order for sexual activity leaves me baffled!?). So the single offence of cyber flash *to the adult* was probably just an aggravating factor among everything else? Rather than him specifically being jailed for that one offence. So we don't know what would happen if an adult offended against an adult and that being the only offence.
Although, how on earth they prove "sending a photograph or film of genitals to cause alarm, distress or humiliation" (from The Guardian) leaves me scratching my head. Yes, there is a big loophole in the law, which is around proving intent. Realistically they would need to show a pattern of behaviour, perhaps looking at any text messages that were sent as well, to establish what the motive was. In Scotland, a lot of men used the 'it was just meant as a joke' excuse, to avoid prosecution.
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JASB
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Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 1.1K,
Visits: 1.7K
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+x+x+x+x[quote]A new offence has been created in England and Wales, so what effect will it have on the courts, prisons and policing? In Scotland, its been illegal since 2010, but 95% of reported offenders do not receive a conviction, so it will likely go one of two ways. a) Hardly anyone bothers to report it, because they don't think the police will take it seriously, meaning very few will be convicted. or b) There will be lots of prosecutions, the courts will be overwhelmed and the judges will be told to stop sending people to prison for it, because the prisons can't cope. Personally, I'm betting that it will be option (a). Hi In my opinion if he had not sent it to a "child" as well, not only would the reporting be different BUT the media / authorities would of either possibly disregarded it or not pushed the reporting of it. For clarity I would / do not condone the offence but it would of been interesting to observe the reaction if the offender had been female. This was an unusual situation. The person was an SO with previous convictions and his sentence reflects the breach of his SHPO as well as him being under a suspended sentence at the time. He used his fathers phone to send the images and told his dad that he was calling probation! I think that the reporting was mainly because it was the first ever prosecution for this offence in England. That's what made it newsworthy. Also the intention of the authorities was probably to send a deterrent message to other men. Because this is so common, most men probably don't even know that it's illegal. Okay, dissecting this a bit, so he had a SHPO and is a repeat offender during a suspended sentence - that in itself completely ups the ante in terms of new sentence. The sending a pic to a child, there’s already a law for that, so that’s not new. But, considering the situation he's already in, meant he would have gone to prison anyway. (Although how he previously got a community order for sexual activity leaves me baffled!?). So the single offence of cyber flash *to the adult* was probably just an aggravating factor among everything else? Rather than him specifically being jailed for that one offence. So we don't know what would happen if an adult offended against an adult and that being the only offence.
Although, how on earth they prove "sending a photograph or film of genitals to cause alarm, distress or humiliation" (from The Guardian) leaves me scratching my head. Hi I think I understand the point you are suggesting but all you have to do is read about other "scenarios" that are suggested cause the "effects" and you will see in this "new societal age" we live in EVERYTHING and ANYTHING possibly causes these emotional effects! You see that now with the "children" of the Post Office shop mangers who are now challenging the Government, and basically claiming the same as the three words you quote! All you have to do is get a solicitor and the media involved and the "authorities" will see a vote winning scenario. In the end a psychologist would do an assessment to support the individual receiving the images claims. I never chastise anyone for any offence but; as i have offered my opinion before on image offences, "an image" can and will create a victim, if it is not requested or permission given or legal for it to be taken. (sorry for the caveats  )
Society suggests I must let go of all my expectations but I disagree, as whilst I have a voice, I have hope.
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope is for tomorrow else what is left if you remove a mans hope.
------------------------------
This forum supports these words, thank you Unlock and your contributors.
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