theForum is run by the charity Unlock. We do not actively moderate, monitor or edit contributions but we may intervene and take any action as we think necessary. Further details can be found in our terms of use. If you have any concerns over the contents on our site, please either register those concerns using the report-a-post button or email us at forum@unlock.org.uk.


Teaching English Abroad


Teaching English Abroad

Author
Message
aim
aim
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)

Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 111, Visits: 2
Wow. A bit of a to-do.

Here's my view with four years of declarations under my belt. I will only disclose when I know I will be checked. Why? Because the person looking at your criminal record isn't likely to have any training in the matter and makes decisions on my life without a formal process to make those decisions. I don't like the sound of that conviction is enough to lose a job offer. The ROA doesn't apply unless your conviction is spent. So while in the unspent phase you're at the mercy of all and sundry.

RichardH - Have a look at this research paper for the effect a criminal record has on your life forum.unlock.org.uk/default.aspx?f=22&m=22493
aim
aim
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)

Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 111, Visits: 2
Well Richard the paper is based on people who have lived with the ROA. Until you're sentenced you won't know whether you're a 5, 7, 10 years or forever at the mercy of disclosure legislation.

But you'll be getting first hand experience of it soon and I wish you luck.
aim
aim
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)

Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 111, Visits: 2
I'm afraid the rules play a massive part in your life when you have a criminal record. What we're talking about is how to play by the rules or avoid them entirely. You've not yet had experience of a basic or DBS check yet with unspent convictions. Or the conversations with people in HR or insurance companies about how it happened. I don't think you realise the impact this will have on your life. Take the cotton wool out of your ears and put it in your mouth? In the nicest possible way of course.
aim
aim
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)

Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 111, Visits: 2
The roles I have always require a check as I work in financial services. And I get paid a lot of money. So no I don't want to waste my years of university education and experience to take a job that pays under £10 an hour so I don't have to disclose. I am not sure what you base your statement spelled out in capitals on? Do you have any data? It seems a lot of places do ask. Even supermarkets. Convictions can become spent but it's a minimum of five years to wait. You'll still be talking about your conviction way after the punishment ended.
aim
aim
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)Supreme Being (19K reputation)

Group: Awaiting Activation
Posts: 111, Visits: 2
Total Applications to Disclosure Scotland
Year 2011-12
Total Applications Received 1,056,122
p. 8 "Conversation with Disclosure Scotland staff suggest that application requests originating in England and Wales account for up to 80% of the Basic application workload."
This is basic checks. www.sccjr.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/SCCJR-ROA-Final-Report-26-June-2013.pdf
As Foxtrot says 2m more will show the entire criminal record, even if spent. 2 million roles that require high level checking? Seems unlikely. See, the playing field is not level.
Ader1
Ader1
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 35, Visits: 0
RichardH said...

The problem is that there is nothing on this Forum that actually helps people practically. I have been looking through the website and the forum. The Unlock publications are excellent, but the advice on here is normally incomplete or wrong. Speaking as someone 'new' to this (as people here say), I don't find any of this helpful. It just seems that most people here want to discuss their difficulties or the general difficulties, rather than discussing solutions.



Maybe you could start a thread RichardH about discussing possible solutions? I think you mentioned before starting one on Self-employment. I don't think it's impossible or maybe even difficult for someone with convictions to get employment except for in 'extreme' cases as you gave examples of earlier. But, getting employment which is anything other than pretty menial and manual work might be another matter. I've spent that last 10 years or so in several soul destroying jobs and now I really would like to do something a little more meaningful where you aren't treated like the expendable employee that you are. Do you have any plans for when all this is over for you? Maybe you could start another thread? And I sincerely hope things don't turn out for the worst for you. I think it's great to have you on here.


"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn



"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn
Ader1
Ader1
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 35, Visits: 0
Thank you very much IanC for giving me up to date information and also for the link you gave forever changes. I need to think things through and will get back to you later.

I really don't know what to say to you Q3 regarding your outburst. I don't know where to begin......


"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn



"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn
Ader1
Ader1
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 35, Visits: 0
Thank you IanC. And good luck with your on-line business. I don't know if you return to the UK much but a friend of mind who lived in Thailand used to return with lots of cheap clothes and sell them once home. Anyway, would it be possible to put the commerce stuff in another thread? I'm interested to read it but this is thread is about teaching abroad.


"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn



"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn
Ader1
Ader1
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 35, Visits: 0
Ader1 said...
After returning from my stint abroad, I can remember reading that for example Thailand and I think other places too had started insisting on Subject Access certificates (are they called certificates?) in order to teach there. Of course, the Subject Access certificates show absolutely everything the PNC holds on you. I'd like to know if any of you know what the situation is like now especially with regards to China?


This is what I said in my original post. I didn't particularly want to go back to Thailand to work. I was there some ten years ago. Fascinating place, people and cuisine. If it was 1995 then I would consider Thailand again but I just get the feeling that it's saturated with westerners. I visited China fairly recently, and I came across people in large 'second tier' cities who I don't think had met a white person before. I got the impression there were more possibilities. But the downside was the almost oppressive (at times) big brotherness. I don't know if it's the case all over China but I was for example using internet cafes then all of a sudden, I was stopped because the police had been around and had insisted that all internet users had to have a Chinese ID card and number. But I did find another place which was willing to bend the rules and allow be to use their computers. Also, many web sites aren't available in China eg Facebook; Twitter and blog sites. But there are ways of circumventing those limitations using VPN software I think they call it. But China is quickly changing and reforming and hopefully will become a freer place. The US and UK seem to be moving in the opposite direction.


"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn



"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn
Ader1
Ader1
Supreme Being
Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)Supreme Being (7K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Posts: 35, Visits: 0
I've just been reading on a Chinese forum a thread about 'Criminal Convictions' and that some employers were looking for criminal record checks. Somebody provided this link: https://www.acro.police.uk/uploadedFiles/ACRO%20Police%20Certificates%20FAQs%20-%20August%202013.pdf

But these aren't meant for employers but for immigration purposes to certain countries like Canada, Australia and even holidays to the US. Do you know anything about this IanC? I know there's a lot of crap on the web. How about Subject Access certificates being requested by some employers in Thailand? I did see it on a Thai forum before. Again these are not meant for employers but for the 'subject' to find out what information the police have on them on their computer.


"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn

Post Edited (Ader1) : 13/08/2013 13:39:11 (GMT+1)



"Everyone is guilty of something or has something to conceal. All one has to do is look hard enough to find what it is." - Solzhenitsyn
GO


Similar Topics


As a small but national charity, we rely on charitable grants and individual donations to continue running theForum. We do not deliver government services. By being independent, we are able to respond to the needs of the people with convictions. Help us keep theForum going.

Donate Online

Login
Existing Account
Email Address:


Password:


Select a Forum....
























































































































































































theForum


Search