ETIAS is not a visa. It is a travel authorisation for visa-free travellers, just like an ETA for travel to the UK from countries whose nationals don't automatically need a visa. If you disclose a criminal record when you apply for a travel authorisation to many countries, they will usually reject your application and invite you to apply for a visa. If you have a visa, you don't need to apply for a travel authorisation (ETIAS in this case).

=========================================================================================================

If you are to punish a man retributively you must injure him. If you are to reform him you must improve him. And men are not improved by injuries. (George Bernard Shaw)

Sorry, I don't get the last paragraph.

As far as my understanding goes:

* A "Schengen visa" currently allows citizens of "third countries" to enter the Schengen Area and spend up to 90 total days there over a 180-day period.  Some countries (the UK being one) are subject to this visa regime BUT have a waiver in place which means their citizens can just roll up to the border and present themselves for entry with nothing more than a valid passport.

* From October 2026, everything changes.  ETIAS will be a pre-approval scheme which applies in both the cases above (and others).  It is on top of the requirement to have a visa (or relevant waiver) and I don;t think you can simply "apply for a Schengen visa" to get round it.  Once ETIAS goes live, the broad visa waiver for UK citizens no longer applies and instead each individual will have to successfully go through the ETIAS process to have the waiver granted again (and only for 3 years !).

Sorry if I've missed the point - always happy to be corrected if so

When you're thinking of which points to stress in your application, your convenience won't be of interest to the court, but your wife's might be. Also, whether or not you think the conditions are unnecessary is also not of interest to the court. The court's decision should be made on the basis of the evidence you present to show that the order is no longer necessary for public protection.Unlock has information and advice here about applying to discharge a court order. You can show when you apply that you have been compliant, but the police might well argue that you were compliant because of the SHPO, and that if it hadn't been there, your behaviour would have been different. In any case, most conditions seem to be standard conditions that are given to everyone, so it would all come down their policy and their risk assessments. You can make the point about insurance costs, but they apply to everyone with an unspent conviction, so whether you can make the argument successfully might depend on what sentence you were given. As you were given sixteen months, your conviction would otherwise become spent four years after the end of the sentence, which would be after five and a quarter years.

Once you get to the five-year point, it's time to think tactically, as I'm guessing the earlier you apply, the likelier it is that the police will object. If they make serious objections rather than routine objections, most courts would probably go by what the police say. The closer you get to ten years, the more likely it is that the court will grant your application, until you reach the point that it might not be worth it as the ten years are nearly up. It might also depend on your relationship with your police contact and local policy, as although they wouldn't be involved in the decision-making process, their reports on you will be taken into consideration.

For travel to the EU, for an ETIAS you would be asked if you have any relevant convictions in the previous fifteen years, from a list of twenty-nine offence categories. They have no way of checking what you say, but if you are on the SOR, there is a chance that the police will notify the destination country once you notify travel arrangements, depending on your risk level. That's the risk level they assign to you, not the fact that you aren't going to offend again. Ironically, if you apply for a Schengen visa, you aren't asked to disclose, so the disclosure part seems to be for residence in a particular country. You could try applying for a Schengen visa, and if anyone asks why you're applying, you can say that you're thinking of travelling in the Schengen zone for longer than ETIAS allows. You can then show that visa to the police if you want, as that might sway them if they have any doubts.




=========================================================================================================

If you are to punish a man retributively you must injure him. If you are to reform him you must improve him. And men are not improved by injuries. (George Bernard Shaw)

"1. Would enable me and my wife to fully move on
2. While the conditions not onerous, they are (in my opinion) unnecessary
3. It makes all insurance costs (the car, house etc..) a lot more giving some financial hardship
4. It may restrict my ability to get an EU visa, disappointing my wife who wishes we can travel more"

These are good reasons to want to have the SHPO ended, but you just need to back it up with evidence.

1. You could argue the SHPO is limiting the things you and your wife can do together, although the SHPO is addressed to what you can not do, it is extending on to your wife as well. 

2. As with the case law I provided, if you have restrictions which simply should not be there in the first place, then it needs to be addressed and corrected. : Example, if you have an image offence non contact. Then having contact restrictions in your SHPO is disproportionate, you could further argue that after living with the SHPO for the last 5 years under these conditions has infringed on your rights to family life. But you may have to prove it by detailing which family members you have who have children under 18 ect. You could even argue the fact you were given a contact restriction with under 18's in stead of the default under 16's. Being given a restriction of 18's should only apply to those who have offended while in a position of trust.

3. Insurances and the extra you have to pay could be your best reason, for having an unspent conviction and being forced to disclose it. You could provide evidence how much insurance you have paid over the 5 year period compared to someone else who pays less while not having a conviction ect, if there is or has been any hardships, financial sacrifices made that would have actually benefited to a change in your circumstances could be used as evidence.

4. Even without a SHPO, I believe when it comes to travel. You are still bound by the Notification Requirements, even if your discharge was successful, you will still be on the register for the full sentence given. If there are any restrictions relating to travel with in the SHPO then technically it should be removed, because it interferes with the Notification Requirements. As I do not travel, this is not something I can really provide further opinions on.

If the SHPO is currently not hindering you that much, complying with the police during their visits may very well help with them determining what risk you pose. If you are already considered a low risk to them, then after 5 years they might even consider or suggest having your SHPO discharged early. It is rare but there are still some good officers out there who do not simply have a guilty till proven innocent approach. Challenge them, ask questions but only answer questions you are required to answer. 

Thanks, very helpful. 
What would be the best reasons to stand best chance to get the order ended? I fear the court will just look at the original hearing and conclude if it was 10 years then, why now change to 5?

Anyway, I'll discover in due course. 

Hi All

This seemed like a good place to answer some questions and to put some further information RE Sexual Harm Prevention Order variations/discharges for others:

Variation/Discharge

You can apply for a variation of a SHPO at any time (as can the Police). 
A SHPO can only contain prohibitions (or positive requirements) that are "necessary in order to protect the public from sexual harm" or that "protect children or vulnerable adults generally, or any particular children or vulnerable adults, from sexual harm from the offender outside the UK".
The Court cannot discharge a SHPO in its entirety within the first 5 years, without the consent of the person and the Chief Police officer. The court can still vary (add + remove conditions, change the length of the order etc) within this 5 year period and does not need the consent of the Chief Police officer.
If sentenced to a SHPO in a Crown Court, it is that Crown Court to which an application for variation/discharge must be made.
If sentenced to a SHPO in a Magistrates/Youth Court, an application should be made to the closest Magistrates Court to where the person currently resides.
There is no proscribed application form. If unrepresented, simply send an email to the court listings office, setting out in full the grounds you rely upon. A date will be listed in due course.

Some matters are dealt with "administratively". This is generally where the Police do not object to the variation/discharge being sought, and oftentimes, the Court will write back to an individual letting them know the Judge has amended/discharged the order in X terms.
If there is any disagreement with the Police, or the Court wishes to enquire further into something mentioned within the Application, generally the matter will be listed for an open court hearing.
You will receive notice of the court hearing, which is a hearing open to the public. Generally, if matters progress to this and the Police are opposing an application, they will be represented by a barrister who acts for the Chief Police officer. 
This hearing is technically classed as a "civil" hearing, although takes place in the Crown Court. Oftentimes there can be "IT issues" at these sorts of hearings, as the DCS (Defence Case System, IT system used by Courts/Barristers) does not allow details of SHPO variation matters to be listed on there, as they are not a "criminal" matter. Therefore I advise taking paper copies of all documents even if you have digitally submitted them.

The route of appeal against a decision, or refusal, to vary or discharge a SHPO is to the Court of Appeal Criminal Division, despite the variation itself being considered a civil matter.
The route is via S353 of the Sentencing Act 2020 which gives a right of appeal to the Court of Appeal (if variation took place at Crown Court), or appeal to the Crown Court if variation took place in Magistrates or Youth Court.

The "five-year period" (for purposes of determining whether the Chief Police officer needs to consent to a discharge) starts from the date the Court made the order. If you were subject to an Interim SHPO prior to sentencing, this does not count. Only when the "full" SHPO came into place does the five-year clock start, which generally will be the date of sentencing for most people.

Generally, there is no legal aid available for SHPO-related matters post-sentencing. The limited exception is that the original firm who represented you may be able to represent you under the terms of the original Legal Aid certificate - generally this would however only be possible within the first year post-sentence. Legal Aid is not available in any other circumstances and paying privately can be very expensive - this should not discourage you though as it's entirely possible to complete the application process yourself with just a bit of patience and research.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All views, opinions & contributions are my own and do not represent the views of Unlock unless specifically stated.

Time on the SOR starts from day you plead guilty, but SHPO usually only starts on day of sentencing. Where there is a long gap between the two, it should really be backdated, although I dont think SHPOs can be backdated, in which case it would be 5 years from date of sentencing. The SHPO therefore extends the time on the SOR and time until the conviction is spent, which would then be the same as the end date of the SHPO.

It's sentence plus 4 years, so I'd assume from date of sentence at court. So mine will be spent after 5 years 4 months (if I get te SHPO removed) and yours after 6 years. Don't know when the SHPO itself starts, but mine is a 10 year one anyway (hence why I hope to get in cancelled when it would be possible to have my conviction spent. 

I'm looking to challenge/ rescind my SHPO  later this year but need to see when my five years is up.  On initial hearing at magistrates I plead guilty and was put on register and had shpo applied  that day. However sentencing at crown wasn't until another 9 months, does  the SHPO imposed count from crown court or from initial hearing at magistrates. My sentence was 2 years suspended  200 hours community service  on the register and shpo for ten years.  Looking to get the order removed as want the conviction  to be spent. Also does the five years count from the date of conviction or after sentence completed ? Sorry if hijacked the thread many thanks 

 

Thanks for replies. 

I'm not eligible for legal aid. I'm retired, and the SHPO conditions do not impact me at all (just annoyance having it). As I have to wait 5 years anyway to get my conviction spent, that will be the time to get the SHPO set aside.