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Lying about convictions


Lying about convictions

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Mirrorman
Mirrorman
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Unspent conviction = unemployment.

Simple as that.
The Pineapple Thief
The Pineapple Thief
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Any employer can check (with your consent) whether you have an unspent conviction via Disclosure Scotland. Details here
This is known as a basic check and is different to a full blown DBS check.


I haven't stolen any Pineapples, but they are a great prog rock band!



I havent stolen any Pineapples, but they are a great prog rock band!
Square
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Mirrorman said...
Unspent conviction = unemployment.

Simple as that.


That is not true. It is true it will severely limit your options, but I like many other members on her have both an unspent conviction and a job.
BenS
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Square said...
It is true it will severely limit your options, but I like many other members on her have both an unspent conviction and a job.


Agreed, I am in the same position.

TheVeronicas, it is not a crime to refuse to fill in the form if you don't want a potential employer to do a check. It will mean you won't get the job but it's not a crime. Without your consent, they cannot do a check - but they won't offer you the job. But it will be almost impossible to find a professional-style graduate job that doesn't ask you about convictions during the application. Have something prepared that they can read, to explain the conviction, as Square has suggested on an other thread.

It will be frustrating waiting the 4 years out until your conviction is spent, but lower-level menial jobs like cleaning, informal labour or retail are more likely to ignore convictions. Try not to feel superior and that certain jobs are beneath you - I am not saying you personally are like this, but I know what it's like - I also have a degree, but it is not an automatic entitlement and no job is below you. Also, consider self-employment if it is feasible for you, then you will never have to worry about convictions as you will be your boss.

Post Edited (BenS) : 03/07/2016 13:24:03 (GMT+2)


BenS
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As to if they can find out (beyond DBS means), it depends whether your case was reported in the press, or even if it's just local knowledge/gossip in your area. HR will Google. If you're on social media, be careful with what you post, erase any tiny reference to your conviction/court/struggles etc. and keep your profile as private as possible.

As you obviously know, it is a criminal offence to lie about unspent convictions, though I can understand the motivation behind it and that's your choice.

According to this (https://www.gov.uk/disclosure-barring-service-check/overview), any company wishing to do a DBS needs to ask you to fill in a form as part of it - so they wouldn't be able to do one without you knowing. The official guidelines also recommend that they only do it with a successful applicant they intend to hire, though that's only a recommendation and not mandatory, they could do it at any stage they like.

You can always refuse to fill in the form but then they will revoke the offer/reject your application so it won't do any good.

Is your conviction one of those types that provokes general disgust when mentioned and makes people run a mile, or is it a minor or less unconscionable type of thing? You don't have to answer/expand on it you don't want to of course.

As an aside, it's a good idea to prepare a letter explaining the circumstances of your conviction in frank, honest terms, not seeking to minimise or excuse it and showing that you are rehabilitated and keen to move on - that you can show to any employer, or that you can attach to an application that asks about unspent convictions (instead of just ticking "no" and not explaining anything, which will mostly get the application thrown straight in the bin).

Post Edited (BenS) : 21/06/2016 11:19:59 (GMT+2)


TheVeronicas
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BenS said...
As to if they can find out (beyond DBS means), it depends whether your case was reported in the press, or even if it's just local knowledge/gossip in your area. HR will Google. If you're on social media, be careful with what you post, erase any tiny reference to your conviction/court/struggles etc. and keep your profile as private as possible.

As you obviously know, it is a criminal offence to lie about unspent convictions, though I can understand the motivation behind it and that's your choice.

According to this (https://www.gov.uk/disclosure-barring-service-check/overview), any company wishing to do a DBS needs to ask you to fill in a form as part of it - so they wouldn't be able to do one without you knowing. The official guidelines also recommend that they only do it with a successful applicant they intend to hire, though that's only a recommendation and not mandatory, they could do it at any stage they like.

You can always refuse to fill in the form but then they will revoke the offer/reject your application so it won't do any good.

Is your conviction one of those types that provokes general disgust when mentioned and makes people run a mile, or is it a minor or less unconscionable type of thing? You don't have to answer/expand on it you don't want to of course.

As an aside, it's a good idea to prepare a letter explaining the circumstances of your conviction in frank, honest terms, not seeking to minimise or excuse it and showing that you are rehabilitated and keen to move on - that you can show to any employer, or that you can attach to an application that asks about unspent convictions (instead of just ticking "no" and not explaining anything, which will mostly get the application thrown straight in the bin).


I've googled my name, and checked my local newspaper, nothing comes up about me.

I do understand that they may do a DBS check years down the line, but at least I will have a job and I can make some money until my unspent period comes up. My friends have already started looking into buying houses, I just want a decent job so I can support myself

Yes I understand that if I don't complete the form the job offer will be removed or me being fired from the job. But at least I have a chance of getting a job.

My conviction is for assult, a fight I had with a drunk. Although the not the worst, no one ones a violent person. And furthermore as all graduates are equal in terms of skills and qualification a person with a clean record will always get the job ahead of me.


But I guess they won't be able to find out about my convictions in my case unless I fill in the form. And the most they can do is fire me if I don't fill the form in?

I saw this poster did the same thing as me https://forum.unlock.org.uk/default.aspx?f=33&m=20542
TheVeronicas
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I am really struggling to find jobs in the gradate market, I know this is because of my conviction, and it will take another 4 years to be spent. My friends all have found good careers and this makes me really sad, I've always been the brightest, and I really want to work rather than sit at home.

If I lie on the application and say I have no convictions, can the employer find out?

The only way to find out is through a DBS check? And they need to ask my permission to conduct it? I have to fill in the form?

My plan is to quit the job of it comes to this?
james gtr manchester
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I've been advised against this by my solicitor and by the police, this comes under misrepresentation.

The whole thing is painful, but there is no choice...
Runner83
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BenS - 5 Aug 15 6:55 PM
Square said...
It is true it will severely limit your options, but I like many other members on her have both an unspent conviction and a job.


Agreed, I am in the same position.

TheVeronicas, it is not a crime to refuse to fill in the form if you don't want a potential employer to do a check. It will mean you won't get the job but it's not a crime. Without your consent, they cannot do a check - but they won't offer you the job. But it will be almost impossible to find a professional-style graduate job that doesn't ask you about convictions during the application. Have something prepared that they can read, to explain the conviction, as Square has suggested on an other thread.

It will be frustrating waiting the 4 years out until your conviction is spent, but lower-level menial jobs like cleaning, informal labour or retail are more likely to ignore convictions. Try not to feel superior and that certain jobs are beneath you - I am not saying you personally are like this, but I know what it's like - I also have a degree, but it is not an automatic entitlement and no job is below you. Also, consider self-employment if it is feasible for you, then you will never have to worry about convictions as you will be your boss.

Post Edited (BenS) : 03/07/2016 13:24:03 (GMT+2)


Hi
Thanks for the advice.
I was convicted of a crime. Originally I had a very sociable personality. The years have passed and due to a lack of social interaction and ability to socialise my social abilities have diminished. I find I can not declare my crime to myself, let alone anyone else.
Presently I'm unemployed and getting income support, and my rent paid. The problem is when declaring yourself self employed all the financial benefits stop.
To adapt to the social situation I have a website. But, this mode of self employment does not guarantee a wage. I can not register myself with Company House as all the financial benefits will stop.
How can I get around this?
Regards
Runner

BenS
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Runner83 - 11 Nov 16 8:03 PM

To adapt to the social situation I have a website. But, this mode of self employment does not guarantee a wage. I can not register myself with Company House as all the financial benefits will stop.
How can I get around this?
Regards
Runner

You don't have to register with Companies House to work for yourself. You can be just a simple self-employed person without having to start your own company.

E.g. if you are freelance/self-employed plumber, maintenance man, translator, tour guide, writer, whatever ... you can just be self-employed, and not a company. Just fill in your tax self-assessment once a year and that's all you need. It's what I do.

If it does not guarantee a wage, I'm not sure. Others will know more. Isn't income support supposed to be something like that, for people who work but don't earn enough?
GO


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